Counter-Strike: Condition Zero: Deleted Scenes


#81

Here is a bit of information I’ve put together:

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CDs AND Counter Strike Condition Zero torrent:
] version
Protocol version 47
Exe version 1.0.0.0 (czeror)
Exe build: 11:46:42 Nov  4 2003 (2567)

cz_alamo2 WORKS!
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ConditionZeroDeletedScenes.rar:
] version
Protocol version 47
Exe version 1.0.0.0 (czeror)
Exe build: 11:12:39 Dec 10 2003 (2603)

cz_alamo2 WORKS!
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Counter-Strike Condition Zero Deleted Scenes v3939.msi:
] version
Protocol version 47
Exe version 1.0.0.0/2.0.0.0 (czeror?)
Exe build: 08:54:25 Aug  7 2007 (3939)

cz_alamo2 WORKS!
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NGHL: Tried...
Counter-Strike Condition Zero Deleted Scenes v3939.msi
ConditionZeroDeletedScenes.rar

] version
Protocol version 47
Exe version 1.0.0.0 (czerorr)
Exe build: 17:40:39 Sep 15 2005 (3248)

cz_alamo2 BROKEN!
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NGHL doesn't run with:
CDs AND Counter Strike Condition Zero torrent
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Overall, it seems to be the version of Half-Life (3248) that causes the cz_alamo2 map load issue. Using 2 different versions of CZ resulted with CZ still saying the same version number. Meaning, the version number in that case is determined by NGHL. So, if you had a different version of NGHL (that uses a different version of HL), then you might be able to use it for a run.

The only thing I didn’t test was the Steam version of CZ DS (both the non-Beta and Beta version). I like using NGHL for the bunny hop script because it works well for climbing boxes (which you do a lot of in CZ DS). Couldn’t I just get the bunnyhop mod and put it into one of the other versions? I think that might be worth investigating.

What version do you guys think we should use?


#82

so what version is this being run on?
steam or nghl? (or won idk)
(im an idiot I didnt see the post above lol)
The good think with CSCZDS is that its not dependent on high fps scripts (ala bunnyhop)
so we just need a version that has the most glitches really
I also see the run is getting ready to start which is exiting


#83

My route for cz_druglab2. Uses the nade boost I found to skip the first RC bomb part.


#84

I have a question about the segments and the run,
002 WindedCone859 [James]
003 WindedCone859 [James]
where do I make the other segment? I know the 002 is the beginning of the map, what about 003?
also is there a new route or is it the SDA one?
one last thing is it on easy or hard?


#85

Oh! I should have explained. Those are just examples. They aren’t anything yet. I just put those there to show how it would look once we start running. So, we haven’t figured out anything yet in terms of routes, so don’t worry about what is on the Times sheet until we start running. Basically, the Routes sheet is the most useful since anything people post, I’ll put in there.


#86

You probably would have (or already have) established this, but it’s possible to make that jump earlier:

EDIT: So I was going to record the potential route for all of drug lab (2, 3 & 4), but the last two levels don’t seem to have any tricks in them that aren’t already in Cool Kid’s IL run that I could find, so I couldn’t be bothered. I did record cz_druglab2 before I decided not to bother, so I’ve uploaded it anyway.


#87

I discovered this little trigger delay in cz_turncrank it saves like a 30sec or a min or something


#88

Wait a second… I just made a realization… does trigger delay work on any triggers? Meaning… in cz_druglab4, there is a part where you start to walk down some steps and they break and you can’t go back up (it creates an invisible wall to block your way). Also, would trigger delay work for… say, triggers that spawn enemies? (which are all over the place in this game).

I have a new route idea for those druglabs ending maps. If I get time tonight, I’ll try it out. Also, I found a potential trigger delay for the recoil maps, but I’m like a few feet away from being able to load in the right spot. Someone might be able to help me search for a good spawn position for that.

Also, another ‘glitch’ that I haven’t really played with. If you try to type (meaning ‘say’ command), the game ‘freezes’. What I mean by that is everything has stopped moving… kind of. Like, if people were talking or fires are burning and other such things like that, those animations will continue, but all enemies and yourself stop moving. But, what you can do is look around. So, basically, you can ‘Matrix’ kill people, because you can effectively stop time for everyone else, but you can still look around and aim at them. I haven’t found a use for it yet, but there might be, so keep an eye out.


#89

Nice, I remember that one. There is a few similar ones on Building Recon. Like no advanced displacement, just getting past obstacles right after the load trigger.

For Turn of the Crank, coolkid had a trick that didn’t work very great for IL. But most likely killer for a segmented run. You can shoot the final boss man through the wall pretty early with the machine gun. Skipping pretty big distance and fights.


#90

Is there a way to easily show/view triggers in GoldSrc? Like, even with some kind of editor or something. If trigger delay works as I’m assuming it does, we might be trigger delaying a majority of the game. It would be potentially quite complex to run. Also, if this works, it could help improve a run for Half-Life over what was done in HL21. I’m pretty excited to test this stuff… :slight_smile: The game almost becomes a TAS because we have to pre-script sequences of actions to perform during the trigger delay.


#91

With some modding work I think it’s possible, pretty sure it was done in NGHL/bunnymod since I saw quad and coolkid use it in their commentary.

I’m interested to know what the improvement on HL21 could be?


#92

I just found the greatest thing ever.
https://code.google.com/p/coldemoplayer/

Edit: This was also recommended:
http://www.demoexplorer.com/info.html


#93

I think most levels will include a changelevel delay. I don’t see how this would affect HL. Bear in mind that most, or at least many delayed transitions will not transfer your weapons. But this is mostly not a problem in DS because: a) You start next level with fresh weapons. b) Many maps have several weapons placed along the level. c) You mostly do pretty good w/o weapons at all. So the odds are good for worthy delayed loads.

There are plenty of changelevel delay shortcuts and tricks in HL that turns out useless for a full game speedrun when you cant transit your weapons over. Thus not used in HL21.

I can write more about the weapon loss later. For viewing triggers, I guess BSPviewer.


#94

I had someone explain how the trigger delay actually works. (I should update the wiki with this info, but for now, I’m writing it here.)
Basically, the server is issuing the client command ‘changelevel’ when you hit those level load triggers. So, when you do all those ‘waits’ before it, it puts it on the back of the queue. So, the only way you could delay other triggers is if the server is issuing a client command to perform the action.
I was testing to see if the server issued other client commands. Maybe like ‘give’ when you receive weapons or other such commands. So far, I haven’t found anything. Unfortunately, most of the sequences in CZ DS seem to be driven by the server (not by sending commands to the client). So, in most cases, flooding the client with ‘waits’ doesn’t affect anything server side. So, keep an eye out for situations in which you might think the server is issuing client commands (I don’t have any way currently to definitively tell if it is or not :-/).

On other news, I was able to find a changelevel delay that works on Recoil. Unfortunately, it is too far ahead in cz_recoil2, so the door you need to get through is closed… and cannot be opened from the other side. Just thinking about it right now… I know where you’d need to changelevel into instead. Where we need to be is the area where you pick up the delta sniper after he’s been ‘captured’. If he is with you, you should be able to complete the level the first time you arrive at the open area near the end of the map. But, I’m not sure if those doors would be opened. Basically, I have more testing to do. Damn doors.

And, I found a new bug. If you are in an area that forces you to be crouched and basically have no room between the bottom and the top of your body (like an incline going up to a ceiling), if you jump a lot and stay crouched, when you crouch on a surface that is not separate from the incline (meaning, your feet never level the ground), you can move at full speed while crouched. This would be very useful for vents. I have no idea if you are really ‘crouched’ or not, but your viewport is like you are crouched. So, that needs some testing too. If it works, I’d name it ‘crouch glitch’ (the same name of the same bug from Left 4 Dead).

Edit: Also, I found out recently… the Easter eggs that say, “The Castle was here” are from a level designer named “Castle”, Russell Meakim. http://castledoes.carbonmade.com/about. He is in the credits for CZ.
Based on that… want to dedicate the run to him? (FOR THE LOLS?) :smiley:


#95

This could also be the cause of the glitch in Lost Cause


#96

If it is the glitch on Lost Cause, that means your viewport is only lower, not your body. So, it wouldn’t be useful then. :frowning:

I found an extremely complicated route for Recoil that uses changelevel delay, but it wouldn’t be faster than simply doing the map normally. :frowning: It seems, for Recoil, because of the number of enemies you need to kill (to be able to lead the delta sniper), it isn’t useful to do a changelevel delay. The only weapon on the second map is a deagle (but, it is possible to kill half the map with the deagle, as I was able to do in my complicated route).
Ironically, it may actually be useful to grab that deagle, even though it is slightly out of the way. The reason would be that the deagle gets 1 shot headshot kills. But, we would need to see that through testing (probably won’t be useful since the M4/M8 should be able to handle the map well enough).

At this point, for Recoil, I’m simply going to look for shortcuts, and the best use of the 4 grenades we get throughout the mission. The first grenade will be used to get up to where you meet the delta sniper. The last three have unknown uses. I think that’s what I’ll be looking into next.

Edit: Actually, make that 2 grenades. I don’t end up going to the area to get the last one. So far, my route uses the one for a grenade jump to the open arched window where 2 shotgun guys are. The other, I use to help clear the DZ. I basically kill 4 people in the DZ. The first is the shotgun guy that runs at you. The second is the AWPer on the upper archway. The other 2 I use the grenade to blow up the boxes they are behind, which kills them.

Also, I’ve figured out how to almost always keep the delta sniper moving. It involves 2 primary factors: 1. There are no enemies blocking him. It doesn’t matter if they are alive, they just need to not be blocking him from moving. 2. You are looking at him. If you continue to look at him, he is almost always running towards you. Basically, the end of the map involves you twitch shooting enemies, running backwards, and looking at the delta sniper. Wallstrafing helps make this much faster too.


#97

Here is the route I put together for the Recoil mission. One thing to note that I don’t say in the video, when you blow up the wall with the remote bomb, I use a doubleduck to get through the hole in the wall without slowing down. It makes it super easy to do. Before, I was trying to time jumps through it. If you have any ideas, please let me know. Thanks!

CZ - Deleted Scenes - Recoil Route:


#98

Nice. Things I thought about:
At the RC bomb, you can take cover in the corner between the MK and the bomb.
What was the reason for jumping over the following enemies and not run past/shoot them? Knife and pistol do have the same movement speed. So I think pistol is generally more useful.
Not sure if the HE boost is faster than going the staircase. If you do go staircase, enemies will spawn very close to the sniper’s door.
Even if doing HE boost, the enemy should be brought before going to the sniper’s door.

You can use “clockwindow 0” to get rid of the freeze after loading a game. And you can find HFR pause aliases in the helpdesk thread. Much better than the standard pause function.

Interesting thing you mentioned about the messagemode pause. Didn’t know about that. You can actually look around during standard pause as well. But you cant see the change until you unpause. In HL you can use the RPG lasermark as indication where you’ll look as you unpause


#99

Good improvement. That does seem to be noticeably faster too.

Ah. I wasn’t aware that knife and pistol have the same speed. I haven’t tested weapon movement speeds in this game. Too used to CS (or even regular CS CZ).

Not sure if the HE boost is faster than going the staircase. If you do go staircase, enemies will spawn very close to the sniper’s door.
Even if doing HE boost, the enemy should be brought before going to the sniper’s door.

Ah. Yeah. I forgot how that trick works. Then, I’d probably segment in approx. the same spot (after grabbing the medkit), then run up the stairs and run past all the enemies. That is some really difficult RNG to get the guy to do that trick, but that’s why we are segmenting, right? :slight_smile:

OMG! You are a lifesaver! I’ve been trying to figure out why the game freezes like that since I started running this 8 years ago. What does the ‘clockwindow’ command do anyway?
I didn’t even see this Helpdesk thread. Wow. Super useful stuff here. Adding that to my links at the start of this thread.

The only thing I thought about related to it… would you need an external script (like AHK) to unpause the messagemode pause? (Since the only way out of it is to hit ‘enter’). If you wanted to use another key, you’d have to map enter to a different key using AHK. Just a thought about it.

Edit: Actually found an answer to one of my own questions after further searching:

Half-Life Linux Primary Server 3.1.1.0.b Beta Update Changelog
  • Added new cvar “clockwindow”. This cvar is temporary.
    It’s designed to combat the speed cheats being used in-game.
    The default value for this cvar is “0.5”.
    We’re very interested in how low you can get this value and not have your players “feel” any
    different while they’re playing. Broadband clients shouldn’t be affected by this cvar.
    Adjusting “clockwindow” should have a greater affect on modem clients.
    As you lower the value (0.3, 0.1, 0.01, etc.), modem clients’ games should feel jittery.
    Adjusting “clockwindow” does not affect the server.
    Only clients will notice problems when the value starts to get too low.
    Please play with this cvar and report your results directly to Eric Smith.

Oh! And you mention this here:


I really like how that fix was only found like 5 years after I was doing my original CZ DS runs. Lol. It was a huge pain-in-my-ass back then.


#100

I hate to do this but, really? How could you miss it? btw I’m still following this thread and getting a mental layout of most maps.
Game still hasn’t gone on sale. Rather not throw more money into steam, right now at least.