# Should we allow Save Deletion? **URL:** \ **Category:** Half-Life 2\ **Created:** [July 12, 2015, 12:26pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668 "2015-07-12T12:26:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Icykittenz](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/i/dec6dc/32.png) [@Icykittenz](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/Icykittenz)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 5:18pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/41 "2015-07-16T17:18:10Z")
ch\_createairboat ---
**Author:** ![darkid](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/user_avatar/forums.sourceruns.org/darkid/32/108_2.png) [@darkid](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/darkid)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 6:21pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/42 "2015-07-16T18:21:22Z")
Can’t you bind quicksave (console “save quick”) and quickload (console “load quick”) via the in-game keybinds pane? If so, then that’s equivalent (basically) to typing reload/kill in console. ---
**Author:** ![Sledepus](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/user_avatar/forums.sourceruns.org/sledepus/32/109_2.png) [@Sledepus](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/Sledepus)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 6:29pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/43 "2015-07-16T18:29:25Z")
My suggestion would be to just add a fixed number of seconds to the run for each save deletion instance. ---
**Author:** ![Jukspa](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/j/51bf81/32.png) [@Jukspa](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/Jukspa)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/44 "2015-07-16T18:34:27Z")
> [@darkid](#): > > Can’t you bind quicksave (console “save quick”) and quickload (console “load quick”) via the in-game keybinds pane? If so, then that’s equivalent (basically) to typing reload/kill in console. Yes you can, but it doesn’t work for save deletion. When you try to load the deleted saved with the quick load bind it just gives you an error and nothing happens. ---
**Author:** ![mike](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/m/58f4c7/32.png) [@mike](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/mike)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 9:04pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/45 "2015-07-16T21:04:50Z")
> [@Sledepus](#): > > My suggestion would be to just add a fixed number of seconds to the run for each save deletion instance. This seems like an obvious bad idea simply because not everyone takes equally long to navigate menus, in a similar way to how the old half-second segment penalty was illogical and arbitrary because no computer takes exactly half a second to load every map or save (among other reasons like how segmented runs are segmented to save time and imposing restrictions is blah blah blah). I’d suggest this is even worse than the segment penalty though, because this actually assumes no variation in human skill, which takes away the competitive element which is the main point of doing SS / RTA runs. Also, having a fixed arbitrary time penalty is practically the same as just not timing it at all. It serves no comparative purpose and hence is not helpful when timing. I guess it’s different with something like a segment penalty which discourages adding a lot of segments, but once a theoretical optimal route with save deletion is eventually achieved (assuming every save deletion saves a large amount of time) there is no point in doing it this way at all. Also, if some glitch or trick is discovered which allows faster menu navigation (not that that would ever happen) we have to be able to make the timing distinction. I’d agree with those who say menus should be timed, although if people decide not to bother for simplicity, please don’t add an arbitrary number of seconds. That is just silly. ---
**Author:** ![Babbaj](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Babbaj](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/Babbaj)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 9:46pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/46 "2015-07-16T21:46:20Z")
Reminder that kill is allowed in literally every multiplayer source game ---
**Author:** ![Babbaj](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Babbaj](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/Babbaj)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 9:59pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/47 "2015-07-16T21:59:18Z")
Reminder that i have the most hours in source games so my opinion holds the most weight [spoiler]:^)[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![execut4ble](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/user_avatar/forums.sourceruns.org/execut4ble/32/14_2.png) [@execut4ble](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/execut4ble)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 10:55pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/48 "2015-07-16T22:55:59Z")
> [@Babbaj](#): > > Reminder that kill is allowed in literally every multiplayer source game Not in CS:GO ---
**Author:** ![Babbaj](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Babbaj](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/Babbaj)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 11:01pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/49 "2015-07-16T23:01:06Z")
> [@˙executλble](#): > > > [@Babbaj](#): > > > > Reminder that kill is allowed in literally every multiplayer source game > > Not in CS:GO used to be allowed in mm, not sure if it’s allowed in pugs but it’s allowed in community servers ---
**Author:** ![PJC](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/a587f6/32.png) [@PJC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/PJC)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2015, 11:32pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/50 "2015-07-16T23:32:53Z")
Babbaj, please don’t double-post unless it’s necessary. In most cases modifying your post and adding “EDIT:” is more appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![S11](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@S11](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/S11)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2015, 3:34am UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/51 "2015-07-18T03:34:40Z")
‘kill’ is cheat protected in Portal 2. Which doesn’t matter at all, because it is still something only accessible via the console. If you’re going to add a fixed amount of seconds for every save deletion, you may as well not add it at all… So what is the agreed upon ruling on ‘kill’ and ‘reload’ then? ---
**Author:** ![YaLTeR](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/user_avatar/forums.sourceruns.org/yalter/32/553_2.png) [@YaLTeR](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/YaLTeR)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2015, 6:39am UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/52 "2015-07-18T06:39:39Z")
I think they should be disallowed since you need console ---
**Author:** ![Gocnak](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/user_avatar/forums.sourceruns.org/gocnak/32/23_2.png) [@Gocnak](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/Gocnak)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2015, 8:46pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/53 "2015-07-18T20:46:14Z")
Reload’s been allowed since the beginning of RTA. I say it stays. Kill is iffy. Since you technically take the shortcut of opening menu and loading your previous save with “reload”, you’d technically be taking the shortcut of killing yourself with “kill.” But the problem for both of them arises when you can’t do it in game. Save deletion requires you to delete the save, so you shouldn’t be able to reload it. But killing yourself quickly with, say, just the crowbar is nigh impossible. Since I’m for reload, I guess I’m for kill being allowed as well. Reload is quicker anyways. ---
**Author:** ![BAGUETTE](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/3e96dc/32.png) [@BAGUETTE](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/BAGUETTE)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2015, 1:49am UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/54 "2015-07-19T01:49:55Z")
The only question I have is whether or not the final decisions will be in favor of a ‘better’ speedrun. Because at the end of the day, isn’t that what actually matters? Not the fact that we allow some things yet disallow others, but because it is generally in favor of making a better speedrun (whatever that entails). ---
**Author:** ![YaLTeR](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/user_avatar/forums.sourceruns.org/yalter/32/553_2.png) [@YaLTeR](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/YaLTeR)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2015, 5:50am UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/55 "2015-07-19T05:50:17Z")
“Better speedrun” is kinda vague because some people may think that noclip makes for a better speedrun, which doesn’t mean that you should allow noclip. ---
**Author:** ![BAGUETTE](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/3e96dc/32.png) [@BAGUETTE](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/BAGUETTE)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 12:37am UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/56 "2015-07-20T00:37:01Z")
But people _do_ run noclip% (however seriously). And it is a separate category, in part, because most people would rather run without it, as well as many other reasons. But this is getting a little off topic… ---
**Author:** ![jagardinpappa](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/user_avatar/forums.sourceruns.org/jagardinpappa/32/309_2.png) [@jagardinpappa](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/jagardinpappa)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2015, 9:29pm UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/57 "2015-07-27T21:29:38Z")
So most people seam to be fore save deletion (judging by the poll) but what about timing the run. Is every one against the way gocnak did it and if so how should we time runs in the future. I mean if we cant find any one thats willing or capabel of changing source split how could we even time the runs without putting in some arbitrary time penalty for each save deletion (other than going by real time which in my opinion is a terrible idea). Also i hate to be the guy to bring this up but i think the top time posted here should be changed back to the 1:30:36 or whatever the last none save deletion run was at least for the time being [http://www.speedrun.com/hl2](http://www.speedrun.com/hl2) ---
**Author:** ![Maxam](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@Maxam](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/Maxam)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2015, 3:07am UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/58 "2015-07-28T03:07:48Z")
Why can’t the run just be re-timed? Add the time between when menu is opened and the sourcesplit timer is resumed. This is accurate enough for the time being in my opinion. Also I just want it to be verified that it is agreed upon that Save Deletion is allowed and the menu time should be timed. If so, the use of Save Deletion should continue. It is slowing down the evolvement of the run to not allow Save Deletion until an in-game timing method is at place (this could probably take a long time?). Half-Life 2 is certainly not at a point where ~1 second faulty timing matters. If this discussion is purely about timing method (once again please verify that it’s agreed upon that SD should be timed) then I can’t see why this is such a big deal. ---
**Author:** ![SuperPcow](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/s/51bf81/32.png) [@SuperPcow](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/SuperPcow)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2015, 5:13am UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/59 "2015-07-28T05:13:03Z")
> [@Maxam](#): > > Why can’t the run just be re-timed? Add the time between when menu is opened and the sourcesplit timer is resumed. This is accurate enough for the time being in my opinion. > > Also I just want it to be verified that it is agreed upon that Save Deletion is allowed and the menu time should be timed. If so, the use of Save Deletion should continue. It is slowing down the evolvement of the run to not allow Save Deletion until an in-game timing method is at place (this could probably take a long time?). Half-Life 2 is certainly not at a point where ~1 second faulty timing matters. If this discussion is purely about timing method (once again please verify that it’s agreed upon that SD should be timed) then I can’t see why this is such a big deal. I completely agree ---
**Author:** ![PJC](https://b-cdn.sourceruns.org/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/a587f6/32.png) [@PJC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/u/PJC)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2015, 9:17am UTC](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668/60 "2015-07-28T09:17:49Z")
Maxam has a point, you could just continue to use SourceSplit and then just add the extra time taken from menuing manually when submitting runs in future. The only other option is to time RTA and then manually cut out the loads which is a huge hassle to do when you’re PBing so regularly. [Previous page](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668.md?page=2) [Next page](https://forums.sourceruns.org/t/should-we-allow-save-deletion/2668.md?page=4)